Phil Aston: Hello and welcome to the Now Spinning Magazine podcast with me, Phil Aston. And in this episode, Iâm absolutely delighted to have with me Tony Martin, one of the UKâs most underrated rock vocalists. Youâve had a really varied career, but what weâre going to talk about today specifically is Black Sabbath and the new âAnno Dominiâ box set. So, welcome, Tony. Thank you so much for joining me.
Tony Martin: Thank you. And thank you for having me on the show. Very cool.
Phil Aston: A bit of context, because I think this is kind of helpful for you. My son is 30 now, but when he was 15, he set up a Facebook group, kind of saying, âOne day, please can we have the Tony Martin Black Sabbath albums released?â That was 15 years ago. He was still at school, half his lifetime ago. And I think in the early time when he set this up, he may have reached out to you and you might have said something like, âI donât think itâs gonna happen, Dan.â And here we are, all these years later, and itâs not only happened, but it comes out this Friday. How does that feel to know that these albums are now going to be available again?
Tony Martin: Well, first of all, well done to your son. It took 15 years, but he got it done. To be honest, thereâs been a few periods when I didnât think it was happening. In fact, about a year ago, Tony Iommiâs manager called me and said, âYou know what, this is just so complicated. I donât think we can do this.â So I was resigned to it not happening myself. Itâs all to do with band politics, really. There are so many people involved or have their fingers in the pie that they all have to be on board. And there were allegiances changing all over the place, left, right, and center. So in the end, it was getting a bit tiring, but well done to Tony Iommi and BMG. My God, the patience they showed to get this thing together and actually get it out there. Wow. But how does it feel? It feels brilliant, to be honest. Iâm very excited. I havenât actually had these albums in my own hands physically for the past 25 years. I gave all mine away thinking Iâd be able to get some more, and I didnât. They just stopped making them. So to actually physically hold them again is really cool. What a great job theyâve done of it. So Iâm thrilled and excited. And Iâm helping out now because Iâm not in the band, obviously, anymore. So I just offered my help to promote it and they said, âGreat, letâs do it.â
Phil Aston: Isnât it amazing? Because Iâve done quite a few reviews about Black Sabbath box sets and stuff, but this one, within about 12 hours, thereâs literally 12,000 views of the review. The love for this period of Black Sabbath is actually huge. Itâs grown. It almost feels as if the profile is higher now than it was at the time.
Tony Martin: Yeah, there is a kind of reason for that. Partly people have got over the âitâs the new guyâ thing, and also itâs been 25 years since. So now weâre reaching out to a whole other group of people, in addition to those that were already there. But to the outside world, it looks like there was a huge gap, and to me it felt like a huge gap. But actually, the fans were always there. Iâve been waiting myself as well to get this back out there. And itâs just band politics, really. Thatâs all it is.
Phil Aston: Because you had that period when it was almost as if this part of Sabbathâs history was hidden because of band politics. None of this really happened, which I think probably stirred up more interest and kind of people wanting to find out more.
Tony Martin: Yeah, it could be. Itâs an old famous thing, you know, if something ainât around for a while, people start talking about it. But yeah, itâs a strange thing, the music business. Youâre either in fashion or youâre not. But I am just thrilled that theyâve got around it. Just the patience theyâve shown to actually put this together. At one point they were just saying, âWe canât do it.â But Iâm really chuffed anyway.
Phil Aston: I imagine thereâs been compromises along the way. Lots of fans probably donât understand how complicated the politics and all the different licenses and everything that goes on over the years, they become more and more entangled. People say, âWhereâs Eternal Idol?â But of course, that was a different record label. Different people own it.
Tony Martin: Yeah, absolutely. Itâs owned by somebody else. And also Eternal Idol, or âEternal Idiot,â as we call it, was kind of reissued not that long ago. Really.
Phil Aston: Thatâs right. With the two CD version, wasnât it?
Tony Martin: Yeah. So they were kind of thinking, âWell, thereâs no real panic because thatâs already been done and letâs just move on.â Because that would have wrapped them up in contracts for centuries, I think. I canât even think that theyâll ever get them to let that go. But they were struggling to get the people involved with these four albums to make up their minds and do stuff. Iâve been all for it all the way along, I have to say. Obviously, because itâs my career, my history. Itâs not just the bandâs history. Itâs ten years of my life that went AWOL. So, yeah, Iâve been up for it all the way along, but some people donât and itâs taken them a while to get on board.
Phil Aston: I think itâs fantastic. The first one was Headless Cross. You joined one of the biggest rock bands with all that history behind it. You were an established singer with the Alliance. But this was a chance, as you say, with Eternal Idol, you went in and it was already prepared. You sang it, but this one was where you could really put your mark on it, your personality lyrically as well as musically. Can you remember what it was like actually being at the beginning of that? Did you feel comfortable around Iommi and Powell and thinking, âRight, what kind of lyrics am I going to do by Headless Cross?â
Tony Martin: Yeah, I was comfortable by then. Well, kind of. The thing is, with Eternal Idol, if I can just backstep a little bit. The Eternal Idol wasnât the first call up. The first call up was in 1986 when they were doing the Seventh Star with Glenn Hughes. And that scared me to death because I canât sing like Glenn Hughes. Nobody can sing like Glenn Hughes. They put me on standby back then, so Iâd sort of tentatively had an introduction to Tony Iommi. Then in â87, they got me in for the audition, and that was the next introduction to Tony Iommi. But because Eternal Idol was already written, that gave me a whole year plus a bit more to find out what this thing was. What the hell was I supposed to do? So just doing Eternal Idol like that was fine by me because I didnât have to discover anything myself back then. It gave me a chance to get my feet in. So by the time it got to Headless Cross, now I know all the guys, and I kind of know whatâs expected of me. I still had to find the âmeâ that I needed to find. I went around it the only way I could, by focusing on things I was interested in. I couldnât do the lyrics and melodies that Geezer was writing for Ozzy because that was a generation before me. The stuff that Ronnie was doing was fantastic, but I couldnât get inside his head. So I had to think about what I was going to do. I had an interest in the old gothic death stuff, like Dracula and Frankenstein, Mary Shelley type writing, and of course, in England, we have Shakespeare. Nobody speaks English like that anymore, that old English text. I thought, âOld English text, gothic death, and Black Sabbath. That might work.â So I put them all together and came up with Headless Cross, which is where I lived. I lived in a village called Headless Cross.
Phil Aston: Yeah, you put that on the map. They werenât pleased about it. The most recognition Iâve got is my name on a bus stop. And Cozy Powell thought the album needed more death, didnât he?
Tony Martin: Oh, thatâs true. Thatâs actually true. We were recording âWhen Death Calls,â and he was in the studio playing, and he suddenly stopped. We went, âYou alright?â He went, âYeah, just remind me, whatâs this song called again?â I said, âItâs called When Death Calls.â He said, âI donât think thereâs enough death in it.â And he carried on playing. So, okay, maybe heâs taking the piss, but isnât it such a great sounding album? As Tony Iommi says, he never left Black Sabbath. So when people criticize him, saying, âYou should change the name or whatever,â he never left. So it was still Black Sabbath. The riffs, the guitar sound was reaching new peaks of excellence around this time.
Because when it was just him and Ozzy, for example, it was guitar, that was it. When Geoff Nichols joined during the Dio period, it introduced a few more keyboard things. That allowed Iommi to play solos against those keyboard pads and chords. And then you come along and start sticking 50 tracks of vocal harmonies on it, like in Anno Mundi and stuff like that. It just kept developing. Sabbath isnât really known for vocal harmonies and keyboards, but underneath that was still Tony Iommi. And it still sounded like Sabbath. We were happy to do that. We just wanted to make Tony happy and do the best for him. It was his band. So we were happy to seek out that Sabbath sound and make sure it did what it said on the tin. A couple of times, like with the Seventh Star thing, he ventured a little bit away from it. Songs like Heart Like a Wheel donât really make the Black Sabbath sound, but itâs still good stuff. I have great respect for all of the eras that went before. I had to sing all of the songs. So I do have great respect for it. And itâs been an honor, you know, like being part of the whole story. But he was the only one that stuck it out. And we respected him for that. Youâre right, they did ask him to change a couple of times. He said, âNo, I canât change now.â
Phil Aston: The next one, if I pronounce this right, itâs Tyr.
Tony Martin: Yeah.
Phil Aston: Because when it came out, me and my friends, actually, because there was no Internet back then and nowhere to go and check it, we did call it Tyr. To be.
Tony Martin: Yeah, Tyr.
Phil Aston: Watch you find in Birmingham. You know what I mean? So it actually rhymes with beer, doesnât it?
Tony Martin: It is, yeah. Actually, itâs Tiw, which is Scandinavian for the son of Odin or something.
Phil Aston: Well, this is almost as close, probably, to Sabbath getting into almost a concept album. Isnât it? This is a collection of songs that in another time and space you probably as a band would have gone out and performed the whole thing.
Tony Martin: Yeah, it wasnât meant that way, but they were struggling to find a name for the album. We were recording and getting towards the end and the management called us up and said, âWe really need a name for this album.â And Cozy said, âIâve got one. Letâs call it Satanic Verses.â We went, âWhat, like Salman Rushdie thing?â He said, âYeah, it would be great publicity.â We said, âYeah, but weâll all be dead.â So we did struggle, but they happened across the artwork. Weâd done Anno Mundi, weâd done Gates of Valhalla and all that sort of stuff. They went, âWhat if⌠Tyr?â It was fine by me. So it took on the Viking sort of theme. By that time, I was thinking, once Iâd done Headless Cross and started to have an interest in the Vikings and stuff. As you know, the Vikings havenât been particularly good for us. They came over and stole all our women and sheep and whatever. But I had an interest in them as well. So I was thinking, every culture, every religion has its dark side. Thereâs always a devil type in a god type. I thought we could go around the world and I could do this. You could pick up on all sorts of cultures and pick out the dark side of various things. But it was the last kind of⌠I still did that with various other songs and various other artists. But Tyr was leaning towards that theme.
Phil Aston: Itâs an excellent album. Then of course, the strangeness of the politics in Sabbath. Dehumanizer comes along and Dio re-enters the scene. You obviously had an opportunity because every cloud has a silver lining. You can go off and do your solo album at this time. But you did kind of like⌠It sounds like it was almost a forced relationship, the way that he was and he wasnât. I mean, how was that period for you? Because you did demo some of the tracks, didnât you?
Tony Martin: Firstly, it was a shock. I didnât see that coming at all. Literally just walking out the door to the next writing rehearsals. My managers called up and said, âThey donât want you to go.â From what I recently found out, although I had my suspicions, Tony Iommi said the record label just wasnât supporting it. They werenât getting behind us at all. Then they started banding about all different names and stuff, and Ronnieâs name came up. They thought theyâd give it a go. He said it was all on and off all the time. After they let me go, it wasnât too long before Tony called me back and said, âCan you come back?â I said, âNo, I canât. Iâm doing my solo album.â More time went by, and he called me back again and said, âAre you sure you canât come back?â I said, âIâm doing my solo album. I really canât.â He said, âDo you want to come down and try?â So I did. I went down and tried putting my voice on some of the songs, but it would have meant rewriting everything, and they werenât going to do that. So I said, âThe best thing is if you finish this with Ronnie, get this done and out of the way, then maybe we can talk again later.â So thatâs kind of what happened. By that time, Iâd done my solo album, which I wanted to get as far away from the Sabbath thing as I could at the time. I went back to doing what the Alliance and some of the bands Iâd been with, that middle-of-the-road AOR type stuff. But when they called me back to Sabbath, Polydor dropped my solo album like a brick. They said, âWe canât do this if youâre going to go back with them.â So that got stopped. Itâs so confusing. By the time I got back with the guys to Cross Purposes, it didnât feel that much of a gap for me, because Iâve been talking to them and working with them through the Dehumanizer thing.
Phil Aston: Stylistically, that album, because it was on the IRS label, I know some people have said, âWell, it should be in there.â Stylistically, musically, itâs very different. I mean, you take it out. These four albums in this set, excluding Eternal Idol, they sound like a progression. Dehumanizer sounds like a kind of sidestep. Even the way the riffs are done in the songs, itâs changed. You take the vocalist out, but the music continued. You took you out and it was very different.
Tony Martin: I suppose it does a bit. If I go back and think over it, I guess thatâs what it was. It was kind of an interruption into the flow of things. When we were doing Tyr, I thought we were doing really well. I thought we were onto something. Dehumanizer, in that sort of respect, does feel a little bit like an interruption. But there was some good stuff on there. Ronnieâs always been a good singer. I donât quite know how they feel about it, but it was kind of nothing to do with me. I just let them get on with it.
Phil Aston: After that, Cross Purposes is probably, out of the four albums in this set, my personal favorite. Geezerâs back in the band now, so youâve got his bubbling bass in there. And again, lyrically, itâs all you. Did you feel any kind of, âOh, Geezerâs back. Will he want to help out?â
Tony Martin: I did ask. He just said, âNo, you can do it.â So I just carried on.
Phil Aston The reason why I love this album is that itâs varied. A lot of people think of Black Sabbath as the Godfathers of heavy metal, and heavy metal is always heavy metal. But if you think back to albums like Sabbath Bloody Sabbath in the seventies, they werenât all heavy metal. There were all sorts of things on there. There were keyboards and light and shade. This, I felt, connected to that album, because you had light and shade on it. So there were more dynamics in the lyrical delivery and the song delivery, in the way that Iommi is weaving his riffs around the melodies. What are your thoughts looking back on this album now?
Tony Martin: I think youâve just summed it up. It did sort of shift up a notch. Not only that, but the sound they were getting with Leif Mases producing it, it sort of grew up. It lifted somehow out of what theyâd done before. It felt like, âOh, this sounds good.â The songwriting and the exploring we were doing with the songs and stuff. At the time, Geezer Butler said thatâs the best album heâs ever been on. He never said that again, but he said it at the time.
Phil Aston: I can imagine him saying just that.
Tony Martin: But it was good. Having Bobby Rondinelli in the band as well. Technically amazing. Brilliant player. His drums close in, and he plays with his wrists. Very technical. Whereas Cozyâs drums are stretched out far and wide. Heâd lean over and hit them. But great to have them both in. What an honor. I mean, itâs Geezer Butler as well.
Phil Aston: When you got to South America, Bill Ward was in for a few gigs, wasnât he? That must have been quite surreal. Bill Ward and Geezer playing songs like Headless Cross, which they had nothing to do with.
Tony Martin: They had nothing to do with. We were kind of weird because once weâd started to get Geezer and Bill back in, they wanted to start doing more of the older songs. That just makes you look, read between the lines going, âWhatâs going on? Whereâs this going?â Once itâs happened to you, you know it. Then youâre reading between the lines. You start to feel it. Then you go, âAh, right.â You can feel it. Theyâre clearing up. I did ask if they were going to do a reunion with Ozzy. Iommi was always denying it. Said, âNo, no, weâre not doing that.â But I didnât mind. The reason for that is because I knew what I could do in the future then. I thought, âWell, if they just tell me, thatâs fine. Cause then I can plan.â The first time it was a shock and I didnât know what to do. But I was kind of keyed up for it the next time. But he kept going. They got Bill in. I love Bill. I think heâs brilliant. We did some shows with him. But for some reason, and I donât know what it is, I mean, I can tell you Iommi loves Bill. He regaled so many stories about when they were out there and how funny it was. I never understood why they never gave him time to get back in it. When you think of Def Leppard, they made a drum kit for a one-armed drummer.
Phil Aston: Yes, very true.
Tony Martin: Surely they can find time to get Bill settled back in. Whatever problems theyâve got. I mean, come on.
Phil Aston: You would think, yeah, very true.
Tony Martin: Get on with it. I thought, âRight, this is going to go south again.â But it didnât. We carried on with Forbidden, and then Cozy came back after his accident. It was really up and down. Confusing. People in and out. During the time I was in the band, there were eight different lineups.
Phil Aston: It was very much a revolving door, wasnât it? Before we move on, I just want to ask, because I know a lot of fans ask this. In the booklets in these box sets, thereâs an image of Cross Purposes Live. That was a VHS tape and a CD. Is there a reason why that wasnât included in some way? Is that game politics?
Tony Martin: I did ask about that, and they were just keen to get on with it. They said, âCome on, letâs go, letâs do it.â What they told me was that theyâre going to take their time now to see what else they can gather and do an additional thing to this along the way with more of that in it. With the Cross Purposes Live and some other stuff. Thereâs a track that I recorded with them when Eddie Van Halen came and did Evil Eye.
Phil Aston: Yes, yeah, Evil Eye, wasnât it?
Tony Martin: Yeah. I used to take the track out. I had it everywhere. Writing sessions, recording sessions, rehearsals. I just happened to be there. I didnât even know who was coming. Iommi just turned up with Eddie Van Halen. I went, âHoly hell, itâs Eddie Van Halen. Whatâs he doing here?â He did some rehearsals with us and then disappeared. Never saw him again. But I got the recordings of the rehearsals that we did.
Phil Aston: Oh, wow.
Tony Martin: So I sent them to Tony Iommi. I said, âUse these. Get these on.â He said, âNo, no, we canât.â The reason they said was anything that has the slightest newness about it looks like a new Black Sabbath track or album track. Theyâre not allowed to release anything new under the Black Sabbath name. So even if itâs historical, they couldnât allow it. Itâs really weird.
Phil Aston: That means there must be lots of live stuff recorded. More bands were recording live stuff from the nineties onwards that you just couldnât work on because it would go out under the Black Sabbath name.
Tony Martin: Not just live stuff. Iâve got about eight tracks that we never released. Just from the writing sessions and rehearsals and stuff that we used to do. They just canât get out. They just wonât allow it.
I donât understand. Well, I kind of understand. When youâre trying to protect your name, your mark, your image, your everything, which is where the band politics comes in, they wonât allow you to do anything that they think. And thereâs all kinds of⌠Everybody from Ozzy to Dio to everybody. They donât want their thing to be diluted or taken away. I do understand that. There are people involved all along the way that have an objection of some kind or another.
Phil Aston: But I guess, hopefully, this box setâs going to sell out really quickly and will show thereâs a demand for this material and for this part of Black Sabbath history. Thereâs a lot of love for it. A lot of people worked really hard within it, like yourself. Theyâre great albums, wonderful songs. If thereâs other music waiting in the wings, whereas we all get older, thinking through the eyes of the fan, it would go down so well, wouldnât it? But I am, as you are, very grateful that these four albums have arrived in a box.
Tony Martin: Yes, itâs an important thing for me. Itâs an important thing for the band, and itâs a great thing for the fans. Iâm thrilled. Itâs been an honor to be part of the story. I love the fact that itâs out there now. They did say there is no limit to the box sets. They have sold out on day one.
Phil Aston: Iâm not surprised.
Tony Martin: They said the way they do it is they tend to poll the outlets and stuff and say, âHow many do you think you can sell?â And they put their numbers in, and theyâve gone way past that. So now theyâve got to go back and produce more. Thereâs no limit to it. I love what theyâve done. Thereâs more in the box set than just the albums. Posters, programs, and everything.
Phil Aston: And then Forbidden. Iâll be honest, Tony, when I heard this for the first time back in the day, I didnât like it. I tried, but I didnât like it. My son liked it because I think probably because his dad didnât. But now the remix, itâs as if someoneâs released the drums and the guitars. It sounds like a Black Sabbath album. It sounds fantastic, doesnât it?
Tony Martin: It does. Itâs brilliant. I love the fact that theyâve dismantled it and put it back in a way that they couldnât or didnât with the other three. Forbidden needed it for all kinds of reasons. It was done under a sort of cloud where a lot of us werenât really into it very much. But it was also an attempt at trying to give Sabbath a kind of acceptable twist to the youth. It didnât work.
Phil Aston: The nineties were weird, werenât they? The nineties were strange for heavy rock.
Tony Martin: The problem was we were fast heading towards great new bands like Nirvana and eventually Green Day and Metallica doing stuff. We were going and they were trying to change the sound to fit in. It didnât work. We didnât think it would. But there are people out there that love Forbidden as it is. I said that to Iommi. Last time I saw him, there are people out there that love it. He said, âTheyâll probably love this version now.â But shaking the chains, guilty as hell, rusty angels, forbidden. And of course, âLoser Gets It Allâ is a great track. That wasnât even on the album originally.
Phil Aston: Itâs brilliant.
Tony Martin: Yeah. Strange. I absolutely love it now. It does sound like a Black Sabbath album. It sounds like it should be there in amongst the others. Theyâve done a great job. Tony and his engineers have really pulled it together. Itâs slightly more guitar and slightly less keyboard. Theyâve done Cozyâs drums. Fantastic job on those.
Phil Aston: Theyâre just unleashed, arenât they?
Tony Martin: Yes. They havenât changed anything. Theyâve mixed it and given it a new attitude, which is brilliant. Theyâve given it more space. It sounds bigger. I just love what theyâve done to it. Iâm really proud of it now. I didnât like it then. Thereâs still a couple of tracks where I would love to have gone back in andâŚ
Phil Aston: Yeah, you know.
Tony Martin: I thought at the time, because I was that off it at the time, my head just wasnât quite there. A couple of tracks I thought I could have done better. I did sort of say when they were doing it, âCan I go back in?â They said, âNo.â
Phil Aston: I suppose because that might edge towards it being a new recording then.
Tony Martin: Yeah, tricky. Iâm not going to tell you which tracks it is, but there were a couple in there that I wasnât quite happy with. But on the whole, itâs a great job theyâve done.
Phil Aston: Because when you were playing live, there were more songs from your period in Sabbath coming into the set, werenât there? You were a unique vocalist in many ways for the band. You could cover Ozzy, Dio. You probably could have done Ian Gillan. Anything. You could have the ultimate set list, really, going through every era.
Tony Martin: That was a bit of a mistake. I told them I could sing anything, really. They thought, âWhat can we give him to sing?â They threw all sorts of stuff at me. I had a shot. Fortunately, Iâve got the kind of voice that can get around most things, and thatâs a result of being in so many different kinds of music. Iâve been involved in everything from reggae to rock.
Phil Aston: Who were your key vocal influences growing up? As you say, outside of this Black Sabbath badge, your voice can go in any direction. So who were your influences? Was it blues, soul, rock?
Tony Martin: It kept changing. Everything I listened to, I thought, âThatâs good. Thatâs good.â Each couple of years, something else took my attention. Iâd really pour my soul into it. When I started off with reggae, believe it or not, I worked with Musical Youth and Dexys Midnight Runners in the studio. I was a guitarist back then. Then I loved blues. I got into prog rock bands like Yes, King Crimson, Jethro Tull. Then it shifted to Emerson, Lake & Palmer. That led to Rush and bands like that. Then I had to come down out of that prog rock technical stuff because Sabbath is much more honest and basic and straightforward. To a point. When youâre in the band and you find out how he does it, itâs stunning. I never even gave it a thought. I thought, âItâs got to be easy.â It wasnât easy at all. Iommi can put seven, eight different riffs into one song, and each one of the riffs could be a song on their own.
Phil Aston: Very true.
Tony Martin: So, wow. You get your head around it. Itâs weird. Plus, the time signatures he was throwing at us. There was a 14/4 and a 15/8 or something he was throwing at us. How he gets his head around it, I just donât know. When I saw him a few weeks ago, he said, âYou did a really good job on this.â I said, âThanks, man.â He said, âI actually donât know how you sang over some of this stuff.â I said, âNeither do I.â
Phil Aston: Just mad, isnât it? You could try anything. I might have thought, âThat means you might be able to put some of the songs in that Ozzy couldnât do into the set. Or I can try something that Iâve never been able to do before because Tony says he can do anything.â
Tony Martin: Itâs because I showed willing. I told them Iâd have a go. And I did have a go. I did put into it. The songs, the writing, the live shows, whatever. I kind of made a rod for my own back in some ways because it was hard flicking between all of the different vocal techniques. But I did my best. It sort of came across okay. The problem is when you try to do stuff like that, it can sound a bit like a tribute act. But we got it nailed, I think. Especially having people like Cozy Powell, Geezer Butler, and all those guys in the band. We were willing to seek out that Sabbath sound, and we were conscious of it. So we were all aiming for the same thing. From outside, it might have looked like a chaotic mess. But on the inside, it all had a focus. We were all willing to give it a go. Thatâs what I think they saw in me. I knew they liked my voice, but I think thatâs what they saw, a willingness to have a go and see if you can make it work. All those different time signatures and riffs that I had to go, looking back, to me, itâs Black Sabbath. Like,
Phil Aston Iâm a Deep Purple fan, and every lineup of Deep Purple is still Deep Purple. I know Black Sabbath, thereâs lots of politics in the way some of the fans look at it. But I think, which is why they had Heaven and Hell later on instead of Black Sabbath, because of the politics. But listening to these four albums, one after the other, you brought to life Viking mythology and song. More death. Just your passion and the way you projected the lyrics and your phrasing makes these albums unique. An important part of the Sabbath story. Finally, do you feel like this outpouring of love for this lineup is validating everything? Any doubt that might have been back then?
Tony Martin: Yeah, doesnât it just? The biggest validation is from Tony Iommi himself. It wasnât regarded that highly until he sat and listened to it without the bickering going around. When I went down a few weeks ago, he said, âYou did a great job on this. Thereâs fantastic songs on here.â I said, âI know.â Itâs just that validation that he gives it. The fact that the fans are returning to it. The fact that weâve got new fans coming to it. Whole new record labels. I think itâs Rhino in America. Itâs BMG in the UK, Europe. The record labels are coming back to it and getting behind it. They see something in it. The management sees something in it. So itâs all coming together. Which is a shame because Iâm not in the band anymore.
Phil Aston Who knows? Maybe you and Tony will think, âItâd be great if some of this other stuff can come out at some point and we donât have to wait another 25 years.â
Tony Martin: If he was going to do that, heâd say, âLetâs just write some new stuff.â But from what Iâve been told, Tonyâs touring dates are done now. He wonât be going out on the road again. Thatâs probably out of the question for writing. I did tell him I was interested if he wants to do something. But heâs got so much going on. Heâs still busy. Doing stuff. He had that ballet, the Black Sabbath ballet.
Phil Aston: Yeah, thatâs true.
Tony Martin: Never saw that coming. No, heâs working on all kinds of stuff. Heâs writing new material for something else now.
Phil Aston: So what about you, Tony? Have you got any plans for another solo album?
Tony Martin: I never actually stopped. For the past 25 years, my career took me into the studio and writing for people. My voice appears on 89 albums and projects now. Itâs been good for me. I owe everything to Black Sabbath because thatâs how the world got to hear my voice. People know what theyâre talking about when they talk to me. âCan you write, can you sing on this?â They already know what theyâre hearing or expecting. I always try to make it better than what they give me in the first place. A lot of that is me in the studio, and Iâm happy, and I still am, happy doing that. But I do tend to choose what I do these days.
Phil Aston: Yeah, that makes sense.
Tony Martin: So Iâm still doing the odd thing for people now. I did have a solo album a couple of years ago called Thorns.
Phil Aston: Great album.
Tony Martin: Yeah, totally unknown guitarist from America, Scott McClellan. I only met him because he kept badgering me on Facebook. He kept sending me stuff. I was like, âGo away.â He said, âListen to this. What about this one?â In the end, I listened to it and it was brilliant. So I gave it a go and it turned out really well. But then Covid interrupted that and we couldnât get out there with it. Some countries were saying, âYeah, you can come,â and other countries were saying, âNo, you canât.â It all got distracted. I havenât finished with Thorns because they wanted to do a vinyl for it. They said we had to take some tracks off to get it to fit on the vinyl. I donât want to take any tracks off.
Phil Aston: Make it a double.
Tony Martin: Yeah, make it a double. Write some more. I wasnât prepared for that. Iâm pacing up, trying to write some new songs. Scott has sent me loads. Weâve got enough tracks for Thorns 2, but I havenât finished Thorns 1 yet. Iâve got to come back to that. I do want to finish that off and get that done. Then if we can do the next Thorns thing, who knows? Weâd like to try and get it out on the road. Getting out on the road for me is so different to the Sabbath thing. The Sabbath machine is huge. They only have to mention it and all the cogs start turning all at the same time all the way around the world. It all starts fitting into place within days, within weeks. On your own, itâs different. I canât do that. I have to hire other musicians to go out on the road and rehearse the whole thing and start again with a brand new show. Itâs a lot harder for me, but I would love to get back out there. My career took me into the studio, so Iâve got more to do. But I just tend to choose now.
Phil Aston: If people want to get Thorns, is it DarkstarRecords.net? Is that the best place?
Tony Martin: No, Battle God. They are the main label. Darkstar were involved and theyâre still there, but theyâve had some troubles in the past couple of years. They were on board and I did two versions of it from between the two territories. I liked that. But mostly now, Battle God is the label to grab hold of it. Itâs still available and Iâm still signing them. People send me the stuff to sign.
Phil Aston: But I havenât finished yet, so thereâs more to come.
Phil Aston: Brilliant. Well, thanks very much, Tony, for all of your time today. Everybody, make sure you go and get a copy on CD or vinyl of this Black Sabbath Tony Martin years box set, âAnno Domini.â Itâs absolutely superb.
Tony Martin: Yeah, it is good. Iâm just smiling. I think itâs brilliant.
Phil Aston: No, thatâs it, isnât it? Whatever anyone thinks, these albums are available again. People can hear just how awesome this time for Sabbath really was.
Tony Martin: Thank you. Thank you very much.
Phil Aston: All right, take care, and hopefully Iâll talk to you again in the future.
Tony Martin: Thank you. All right, Phil, thanks, mate. Cheers.
Phil Aston: Well, a huge thank you to my guest, Tony Martin. That was fantastic. Iâm almost lost for words in knowing what to say to sum up that interview because I know a lot of you are really interested in this box set, âAnno Dominiâ by Black Sabbath, which is out on CD and vinyl. Just as I thought, itâs sold out already, but thereâs going to be another pressing. I was able to ask some of the questions I know some of you have been wanting to know, like why werenât there extra tracks? Why wasnât the live Cross Purposes included, etc. So now you know. Some of it is really exciting because it means there might be a companion set with some outtakes or live stuff as well. Thatâs really exciting.
Tony Martin is a fantastic vocalist, really passionate, really imaginative with his lyrics and his vision of how he writes his music. These four albums are essential. Theyâre Black Sabbath albums, okay? Thatâs what they are. They sound like Black Sabbath albums. Wasnât it interesting that Geezer Butler said Cross Purposes is the best album heâd ever played on? It is a truly remarkable album. But they all are: from Headless Cross, to Tyr (which I can now pronounce correctly), Cross Purposes, and Forbidden, which has been given a new lease of life. Seriously, it is incredible. Just stunning.
Thank you again to Tony Martin for joining me here on the Now Spinning Magazine podcast. Please keep spinning those discs, whether they are vinyl or CD. Check us out on the podcast. Weâre on every platform you can think of, from Apple to Spotify to Amazon. Of course, weâre on YouTube. Please subscribe and check out the website at nowspinning.co.uk. Remember, music is the healer and the doctor. So take care and Iâll see you all very, very soon.
Watch the full interview here Phil Aston Now Spinning Magazine We're now onto the fairy episodes. Spoilers ahead, read at your entire risk
Deep breath this is probably my least favorite Strawberry Shortcake episode. I only remember seeing it once before this, and I was pissed off by some elements of this episode, which I will get into. We open with Strawberry harvesting berries. She and her pets see some movement in the bushes and finds out it's a fairy. This fairy, who is named Margalo, falls and hurts herself. Strawberry offers to take her in so that she isn't snatched up by a crow, which Margalo accepts. The pets don't like her right off the bat, and for good reason. Margalo quickly starts taking advantage of Strawberry's kindness, to which the latter is completely oblivious. Ginger comes over, and immediately loves Margalo. This leads into the musical number where Margalo talks about her magical power of ripening berries. Afterwards, Strawberry offers to introduce her to the rest of their friends. Ginger just so happens to have a miniature car that Margalo can use, since she's afraid of heights. Angel agrees to make a cake dollhouse, Blueberry offers some doll clothes, and Orange has some mini dishes. Custard and Pupcake start getting suspicious of Margalo's supposed injury. That night, the pets see Margalo flying and stealing jam. They tell Strawberry the next morning, but Strawberry refuses to believe her. Margalo covers her ass by claiming there was a crow in the house. Strawberry in this episode is more naive than usual. In most cases, two words against one wouldn't look so great. Also, a normal person would question how a crow would have even gotten in or out of the house, since there's no mention of a window being left open or anything like that. Margalo manipulates her into thinking the pets are making issues since they aren't the center of attention. The pets borrow some stuff from Blueberry's closet to disguise themselves as crows (which, come on, that wouldn't fool most people). While the humans are distracted, the pets pretend to be crows in an attempt to trick Margalo into flying. Margalo covers her ass as soon as Strawberry gets to the scene, making Strawberry and the other humans scold the pets. The pets leave, since they're clearly unwanted. Strawberry eventually realizes they're gone. We also get Margalo explaining that she didn't fit in with the other fairies (maybe bc you're a selfish, lying POS), and that gives us as the audience insight into why she doesn't want to leave. Strawberry's friends agree to give Margalo a makeover, since the latter claimed that the other fairies made fun of her appearance (pretty toxic message to send to our young audience). Meanwhile Strawberry finds her pets (she tells them that she'll always love and make room for them, but since she still thinks her pets are in the wrong, we don't get a proper apology), and they also see that the berries are dying bc Margalo isn't doing her job. Strawberry comes home to see Margalo's ridiculous makeover and tells her that the berries are dying. Margalo is like, "um no, you do it," and Strawberry, instead of being like "no I can't," is like, "okay, I'll try." This could have been the perfect opportunity for Strawberry to call out Margalo on her shit, but we never get that in this episode. With stories like this where one party takes advantage of the other, the satisfying conclusion would be when the victim stands up for themselves. The writers acted like Strawberry didn't need any growth or development, but in an episode like this, she very clearly did. Anyway, Strawberry realizes that she can't save the dying berries (no shit, Sherlock). Meanwhile, Margalo starts feeling bad about what she's doing, but then she encounters a crow. At first she thinks it's one of the pets in disguise, but nope. Strawberry comes back just in time to see her flying. Custard and Pupcake decide to help. I would have found their choice more realistic if they had received a proper apology some time beforehand, but oh well. The pets save Margalo, and then she apologizes for sticking around for so long, but that wasn't enough for me. I wished Margalo had confessed that her wings were fine, and that would have made Strawberry realize that her pets were right the whole time. We then get the second musical number where Margalo's makeover is undone, and preaches that it's what's inside that counts. We end with Margalo bringing along her new fairy friends (turns out it wasn't her appearance that was preventing her from fitting in, who would've guessed). This is probably one of the most angry reviews that you'll see from me. The pets deserved an apology, and we needed to see Strawberry standing up to Margalo a whole lot more. The message of this episodes is all over the place. It seems like it should be an episode about standing up to people who take advantage of you, but then there's this stuff about Margalo not fitting in, which felt shoehorned in. I think it would have helped with the plot if Strawberry met another fairy who spilled the tea on what Margalo did to her, making Strawberry realize that her pets were right all along. Overall, this episode is frustrating, and even though this series ended years ago, I hope that people who create kids media can learn from the mistakes of this episode.
Comment your thoughts below!
Love the sub- just stumbled across it.
Class of 91 metalhead, and unapologetic fan of hair metal.
I have a lady friend, same age, who was a pop/synthetic pop post punk fan... cure, pet shop boys, Duran Duran. Never exposed to good metal aside from top 40 stuff. (Also well versed in 70s pop)
I am on a quest to "class up" her musical taste.
I have been hitting her with an ever deeper selection of deep cuts, baby steps, to get her to be on board with my driving tunes...lol.
She mentions she loves "patience", so I hit her with some tesla. Signs and love song. She had heard them, but didn't "know" them.
She is very lyrically oriented, so I went a little heavier with tesla- what you give and the way it is.
She digs it, so I move on to some cinderella. Started with "through the rain", then worked backwards...heartbreak station, coming home, don't know what you got, nobody's fool.
It is going well, so I slip on over to ratt. Givin yourself away.
Then I hit her with some april wine- if you believe in me. She loves it.
I go deeper, lillian axe, the day that I met you.
Every mother's nightmare, love can make you blind.
Quireboys, I don't love you anymore.
Wasp, forever free
.... then I play a couple where I don't tell her the artist- I don't want her prejudice to override the song...
Room with a view... she loves it and I tell her the band is "death angel". She is floored.
Goodbye to romance... and to her credit she recognized ozzy. Loved it.
I decide to really push the limits... went for a band no woman in history would bother listening too...(a joke, but a grain of truth) master of the wind, Manowar.
On and on I go, opening a new world for her and she loves it.
It is very interesting how when you remove the image of metal and the names of the band, people listen with an open mind and find out they have missed out on some great jams.
They might be a bit bright for some, but they just sound soo good to me. I really like the tunings.
Tanchjim Zero is a bit lacking in bass impact. I'm not looking for Moondrop Chu 2 level of impact, but I'd prefer if it was closer to the level of Simgot EW200. For the average person, I think the Zero might be way too lacking in bass. But for me and the music I listen to, it's just a bit lacking. It's fine, but I prefer EW200 for bass. Overall I really like the Tanchjim Zero. I think they sound fantastic for less than 13 dollars. But they might be a bit too brightly tuned for some people, and a bit lacking in bass.
EW200 is really good. Like, soo good. I won't go into too much details since this isn't a review post. They have really good details and clean sound for their price. Nice sound character. But the feeling of spaciousness is lacking. Music sounds like it's being jammed against my brain. I'd rather have something with more of an "atmosphere" and not as "claustrophobic". Idk what's causing it. I don't see other reviews talking about it. So I don't know if you guys can understand what I'm talking about. I try not to use fancy audiophile terms when I don't have to.
I also very much like the sound of the ever so popular Truthear Zero Red. I like that it's more relaxed than EW200 in the treble region. And also more sense of space than EW200. Feels like the music has a bit more room to breathe. I didn't mention the Zero Red in the title, since I don't know if I'd want an upgrade to this type of sound. But if it's smooth and detailed and very good for female vocals not overly bassy, then I'm still sold nonetheless.
It seems the EA500LM would be a sound upgrade from the EW200. What do you guys think?
There's also the Tanchjim Origin which is kinda pricey and not sure if it's worth the upgrade. But I do like Tanchjim Zero a lot, just not sure how similar they are.
My music taste is weeb and dated and mainly female vocals. J-pop, anison, game OSTs, mainly from the 90s-2000s time period. I'm def not looking for basshead thumping bass quantity. IEMs like Davinci are kind of out of the question......probably.
Test road both in Med and Ultimate felt better upon first sitting (which really threw me off.) But was rushed because it was raining.
Best fit with the (integrated cockpit and 15 mm max of headset spacer limitations) will trump bump absorption comfort.
Currently ride a 2013 Gran Fondo 2.1c professionally fitted, so either bike will be an upgrade.
Currently ride about 100 miles a week, while training for the odd Century every couple of years. I do like to chase personal PR's in the local hills and on the flats around Los Angeles. Riding all day, or half days at slow speeds, (just sight seeing is not my jam.) But I do want to be comfortable, as I ride quickly. I do have mostly smooth pavement to ride, and can avoid the super rough paved roads for the most part. Zero Gravel or bikepacking aspirations, I'd rather MTB, DH, or ride the moto.